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CritterMap
nurse bee
Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 40
Location: Camas, WA, USA
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 Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 9:03 pm Post subject: Distinct Flavors? |
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The store has products like blackberry honey, fireweed honey, etc.
I can see where this is practical in monoculture with pollination contracts. I'm not so sure for someone with a backyard TBH surrounded by a diverse countryside.
For example, in my area, it's easy to see how the blackberry honey would dominate for a certain period of time. But even in this period of time, I don't expect that it would be 100% one flower.
How many of you are able to identify distinct flavors/sources of honey? Or feel confident enough to label your honey something particular when selling it at the holiday craft sale at your workplace?
Do the bees place all of the different honey flavors in different sections, with easy to read labels enscribed with the scientific name?  (Well, one could hope.) Or are there particular skills and experience you need?
Thanks
Nathan |
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biobee
Site Admin
Joined: 14 Jun 2007
Posts: 1924
Location: Devon, SW England
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 9:56 pm Post subject: Re: Distinct Flavors? |
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| CritterMap wrote: |
Do the bees place all of the different honey flavors in different sections, with easy to read labels enscribed with the scientific name? (Well, one could hope.) Or are there particular skills and experience you need?
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Oh yes - it's called 'marketing'.
Seriously though, you can distinguish different flavours on a single comb, with the aid of a small spoon, but I think the best anyone could say of those 'single flavour' honeys - with the exception of OSR, clover, ivy and heather, perhaps - is that they are 'mostly' such-and-such.
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The Barefoot Beekeeper www.biobees.com |
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charker
guard bee
Joined: 23 May 2008
Posts: 92
Location: VA Beach, VA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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I think naming a honey after a particular plant, even for a small scale beekeeper, is a matter of being constantly aware of what is in bloom and timing your harvests. One beek I know has a lot of tulip poplar trees near him. After they stop blooming he takes some honey and it is a deep mahogany color with a rich, dark flavor. A few weeks later he harvests again and it is an amber color and lighter on the tongue. Another one sets up hives to pollinate a few acres of strawberry fields. The honey harvested after the berry plants stop blooming is pale yellow with a light and fruity flavor.
These honeys are sold as "tulip poplar", "wildflower" and "strawberry" honey, resp. The nectar that made up these honeys did not all come from the named plant but enough did to give the honey a distinctive character. So if you have a lot of blackberry vines in you area - enough to give your honey a unique flavor after they bloom - I see no reason that you could not legitimately call your honey "blackberry honey". It might take a season or two to get familiar with the local foliage and seasonal rhythms so you can time your harvests (not to mention good record keeping) but the worst that can happen is that you learn more about bees & trees. |
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CritterMap
nurse bee
Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 40
Location: Camas, WA, USA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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OK, sounds like fun. 
I may be able to identify willow honey, apple blossom honey, and/or blackberry honey. And maybe morning glory honey - they seem to be covering the spot where I haven't planted a lawn yet.
Or maybe not. I'll see what happens. |
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charker
guard bee
Joined: 23 May 2008
Posts: 92
Location: VA Beach, VA
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I may be able to identify willow honey, apple blossom honey, and/or blackberry honey. And maybe morning glory honey - they seem to be covering the spot where I haven't planted a lawn yet. |
That sounds like a setup for a good wildflower honey. If you get a major nectar flow from one plant (by which I mean that this plant is prevalent in the area near your hives) for a time, you might be able to harvest honey that is flavored mostly by that nectar. Maybe you're near an apple orchard or there's an abandoned farm that has been overrun by blackberries in your neighborhood. But I would caution you against micro-managing and trying to get too many niche honeys out of too few hives.
Are there still wild blackberry stands near you? Or have most of them been overrun by the Vancouver 'burbs and their attendant useless shrubs & sterilized lawns? |
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CritterMap
nurse bee
Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 40
Location: Camas, WA, USA
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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| charker wrote: |
Maybe you're near an apple orchard or there's an abandoned farm that has been overrun by blackberries in your neighborhood. |
Yes to both. that pretty much describes my backyard. I think there are six or so apple trees, and more in the neighborhood. There may be more that are fully engulfed by the blackberries.
| charker wrote: | | But I would caution you against micro-managing and trying to get too many niche honeys out of too few hives. |
No worries there. My five acres of land is a drop in the bucket for two mile flights for the bees. I can't really control what flavor I get. But it can be fun to discover and work with what it is. And if i can plant something that will bloom in scarce times, even better.
I'll know more after a few years of doing it, but here's my guess now.
From local charts, the blackberry honey will dominate when it's in flow. Apple honey is apparently rosy-pink, so I will know *if* it dominates a flow. Wildflower, including dandelions in the neighborhood, is probably the best base. In early spring, pollen and nectar from willow will probably be fed to brood.
| charker wrote: |
Are there still wild blackberry stands near you? Or have most of them been overrun by the Vancouver 'burbs and their attendant useless shrubs & sterilized lawns? |
No worries there either. I just moved from the burbs to a place with a decidedly rural character. Nothing sterile about my new "lawn" - it's three feet high in spots. My best plan is to plant into the cleared areas with native eco friendly lawn - it would contribute to the wildflower honey for sure.
The blackberries here are non-native and invasive, but in the unlikely event that I were able to conquer them, I'd want to replace them with native berry plants.
I can most easily show you. It looks like this. Except there is a house now where the arrow is. The yard goes back to the treeline - the border of a Land Trust habitat, and wraps around to 38th.
http://maps.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&FORM=LMLTCP&cp=rm7btv4syzx1&style=b&lvl=1&tilt=-90&dir=0&alt=-1000&scene=5549649&phx=0&phy=0&phscl=1&encType=1 |
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charker
guard bee
Joined: 23 May 2008
Posts: 92
Location: VA Beach, VA
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Sweet! That's a great spot. And you could have as many hives there as you can handle, or more! I'll trade you a jar of tulip poplar honey for a jar of your blackberry honey next year :D |
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il volpe
guard bee
Joined: 14 Aug 2008
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 3:23 am Post subject: Re: Distinct Flavors? |
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I don't think the US has labelling laws about this, but I'm under a vague impression that there's some organization with a rule that to label your honey 'varietal' you get it microscopically inspected and find that over 60% of the pollen in it is from your specified floral source.
| Quote: | | For example, in my area, it's easy to see how the blackberry honey would dominate for a certain period of time. But even in this period of time, I don't expect that it would be 100% one flower. |
It might be very close. I can't remember the numbers, but they really do have a funny tendancy to concentrate their attention on a single productive species of flower when it's abundant, even if there is plenty of other stuff around. If you taste what they've recently capped during the blackberry bloom, it'll probably taste like blackberry honey.
I get two 'varietals,' sort of. The early spring honey is paler and has a high clear taste. I know it's mostly blue penstemon because the years when blue penstemon blooms very abundantly and covers everything that honey is white as water and the taste difference is extreme, and the taste is very like the smell of the penstemon blossoms. Later I get an amber summer honey.
One year we planted the garden patch with buckwheat, late so it'd bloom in the fall for the bees and freeze before it could set seed. The dark dark buckwheat honey was different enough from the amber 'summer wildflower' honey that you could just look at the combs.
Anyway, no special skill required, just a little bee-watching and taste-testing. I have langstroth hives and an extractor. I extract the mixed combs that have both 'penstemon' and 'summer wildflower mix' into the 'summer windflower' vat and try to keep the white honey 'pure.' On a good penstemon year, I'm confident enough that it's made pretty much entirely of penstemon nectar. The food chamber below is full of the same stuff, I can find the transition-comb where the penstemon stopped blooming.
http://www.waynesthisandthat.com/honey.htm |
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