Natural Beekeeping International Forum

[Michael Dreyer]

Hi everybody,
have you heard about the latest thoughts on TBH desigen? It's called cathedral hive. How do you feel about it?
Here is the link:
http://www.backyardhive.com/the_cathedral_hive_the_next_evolution_in_top_bar_hive_design/

Kind regards
Michael

[ingo50]

Thank you for posting this very interesting design Michael. I will be very interested to see the plans or fotos of this hive when they are finally released. This hive will be technically a lot more challenging to build than a TBH. Most DIYers will probably not be able to build it easily. I would imagine that the lid would have to overlap and wonder about the thermal insulation and thickness of wood used. The frames would require a jig to ensure accurate and equal production. Is it a sealed hive or is there some ventilated floor?

[stevecook172001]

This very design was discussed on here some months back, if I remember correctly.

I'd like to see how they stop these bars from toppling over in the early days of comb building where they will be top-heavy.

[ingo50]

Steve can you remember what name it was given. I have searched this site under Cathedral without any hits?

[trekmate]

Original thread - http://www.biobees.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=16002&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

As I said before, making a beautifully simple concept very complicated!

[rmcpb]

I have often commented that the box type is for the person, not the bees. This is a prime example.

Cheers
Rob

[catchercradle]

I am sure that if given one I would enjoy using this hive. As it is, construction is probably beyond my skills for making the frames accurately and the cost is probably prohibitive for me to buy one, still any donations welcome!

[Smorning]

[SueBee]

I'm in the process of building a cathedral hive right now, and hope to have it up by swarm season this year. I'll post photos and let you know how the bees like it!

[Barbara]

Hi Sue

Will be very interested to see the finished product but could you possibly also take construction photos as you go.

Regards

Barbara

[SueBee]

Will do, Barbara. I have a woodworking friend who is helping me along the way. We have the three-part bars done. We're also slightly modifying the hive so that we put an eco-floor on it.

This summer, I am also turning my attention to skeps and sun hives. We have a sun hive workshop in the fall, and I'm practicing making skeps this winter.

[Barbara]

Oh Wow! I'm very impressed Sue! You don't do things by halves do you!

I'm hoping to go to a skep workshop run by my neighbouring BBKA group later this year. The group that covers my area is very conservative and conventional but the neighbouring one is quite progressive I'm told. I'm not quite sure what to expect, whether it will be a skep beekeeping or skep making workshop or a bit of both. I haven't seen any information on it, just word of mouth that it's happening and that places will be limited.

I will be very interested to hear your thoughts on all these different hives when you get them occupied and running and find out if you have a favourite.

Great that you have a woodworking friend to help you. My partner was a woodwork/metalwork teacher but he doesn't seem to enjoy making things now that he's retired,

[SueBee]

Great Barbara, we can compare our skep effort photos! I've been thinking about what it would take to keep bees comfortably in a skep, and I DO have cover over my little bee garden, which I'm certain is necessary. I was also thinking of setting them on an "eco-box" so they could have a box of deep floor litter beneath them. The sunhive, I will hang. I like the idea of having a bunch of conservation hives of various kinds, and a couple hives I can get into easily and actuallyt "work" a few times a year.

We're also holding a log hive workshop---zeidler beekeeping---in April. Needless to say, I'm just all in a buzz!

[Kjeldebu]

Hi,

The design seems indeed overly complex and as to wether it serves the bees better: well, we're just beginning beekeepers (our first colony since before yesterday, yippie), who are we to tell?

I was wondering what you think of the Super Highway? It sounds like an interesting concept and would be logical to prevent bees from having to move from one comb to the other by the bottom. The idea of herding the bees away through those holes seems nice too.

We will be building a TBH, why not add the highways to it?

Any thoughts?

Jonathan & Dominique

[SueBee]

I've had bees in my cathedral hive since March when we started our swarm season. The first group was tiny and perished. The next group absconded. The third group is building like crazy. Corwin has now made bee-highways and slits for regular top bar hives.

I haven't gone into my cathedral hive since the last group took residence about a month ago, but I LOVE looking in the viewing window and seeing the faces of those long, big combs! When I did go in to home my swarms, they all instantly took to the highways. Early to tell with this hive design, but so far, I am liking the long combs, the ease of viewing, and having no question that the bees can have as much or as little ventilation as they desire. I don't like having to second guess bees needs.

Further updates: I have indeed taken the classes on making SunHives. I have one completed, and another I will begin soon with thick organic hemp rope to see if there are other good alternatives to rye grass.

For now, I have six hives: 1 Warre', 2 top bars, 1 cathedral, 1 log hive, and 1 small swarm in a wooden bucket in my bedroom with an outside flight tube. All are building up very nicely. I hope to add a swarm to my Sun Hive after I get it sealed with cow dung. I'm bee-ing a happy girl these days!

[beegraham]

I have just finished one and I intend stocking it with Nuc or swarm at the end of June. On hols abroad at present otherwise I would have stocked up already.
It is a fascinating design to be sure and one I hope to begin beekeeping with For one reason or another those into bees with their conventional national hives and similar are very dismissive of innovative designs but I for one, am of the opinion Cathedral hives have merits of their own. The big no no is the fact that they are time consuming to make. Fortunately I have the time and sufficient woodworking skills to be able to produce one by studying the photos. //goo.gl/photos/dTxKYjELaM5x4b8x7

[SueBee]

Yes, the building is way out of my league, but I love the long, deep combs. It is , I think, more of a vertical orientation for the bees, which I know they like. The colony has completely taken off, going from my smallest swarm to the largest colony I have in two months. They are about half-built out now. When full, it will be a very large hive of bees, and I don't have to do any stacking!

My bees in my log hive-round are going nuts, also. The wood is maple, about 4 to 5 inches thick. No problem for winter insulation in there!

[beegraham]

P.S. I have used Ash and Western red Cedar with the top half roof clad outside with a double skin plastic roofing. Wood is approx 7/8 in thick and plastic 3/8in. painted white. A sticky floor tray of balsa coated in Vasaline is provided as a Veroa trap beneath an aluminium latice barrier. Plenty of ventilation is provided too. The ends of the top bars have a hardwood cill to butt against that stops them slipping off the edge when the roof is lifted off. Ideally I would like to add a hinge to save lifting bodily up and away. A later mod to follow perhaps.

[velacreations]

This is a simpler way of achieving the hexagon shape for a hive: https://www.beescientific.net/

[beegraham]

Since I placed a swarm into my top bar hive on July 17th it has grown and seems to be flourishing. 5 well developed combs and two fresh ones.
http://moggo-blog.blogspot.co.uk/2016/07/bee-progress.html

[Thebigflyin]

Huy thats so cool man!!

[beegraham]

Convinced this is a first rate design I have now built a further three Cathedral type hTBH to be ready for the spring 2017. For images etc. see herehttp://moggo-blog.blogspot.co.uk/2016/09/how-to-make-beehive-old-remedy.html and a further post here of my expanding colony now occupying eight bars of the total twenty three bars: http://moggo-blog.blogspot.co.uk/2016/10/cathedral-top-bar-bee-hive.html

[mal]

Hi Graham,
What angle is the bevel on your bars ? They look pretty steep and was wondering about the attachment strength in relation to this discussion http://www.biobees.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12446

Of course - there is an inherent stronger attachment due to the cathedral shape, and use of fixed foundation

I assume the relative steepness is a) attempt to reduce cross combing, and b) to leave access space to the highway ?

Thanks

[Cempfire]

First and foremost it is not for the multihive beekeeper. The sheer expense in time to build is outrageous. I get the Bee “super highway” and all but the bees just move under and around the comb. As for keeping warmth in and cooling bees don’t tend to breakdown propolis they have built. You can’t produce the bars without being an expert woodworker and owning a crown stapler, building a jig and using lots of glue which I am, and do, and did I bought this on a whim and will give it away to my son in law who wants to have “a” hive.
If you plan on having “hives” they have to be maintained and replaced. If you want to build something neat and productive to raising bees build a “Rose hive”. Not a fan of this one as it is a bulky one hit wonder.

[SueBee]

My bees are part-way through their second winter now in the Cathedral hive. I far prefer this hive to regular top bar hives, because I really love the long combs. It is easy to get into, and my bees have not cross combed much at all. The bars stand up just fine even before bees are in it. They seem "tilty" when you stand them up, but they work just fine in practice.

I'm endeavoring to keep smaller hives now, and to encourage swarming (as per Thomas Seeley), so the Cathedral hive is a bit big for me. I have the follower board closing off the third back of the hive.

This winter, I heavily insulated the hive with insulation panels. The first winter, the colony shrunk down so tiny I could not see ANY bees through the viewing window for many many months, and there was little activity on the nicer days. But come spring, the colony took off, going into second winter very strong and staying that way.

[beegraham]

Cathedral (Barn) Top-Bar Hives. Now well established with three doing well but a fourth still empty. Attempts to get a colony to move upwards into it out of a standard top bar hive ongoing. (A la Bailey comb transfer).
https://photos.app.goo.gl/BcgEobXkwpjJDJfc2

[beegraham]

Early October and 3 Cathedral hives doing OK Just Sugar Dusted but will follow up with OAVapour in December.http://moggo-blog.blogspot.com/2018/09/dusting-top-bar-hive-with-sugar.html

[beegraham]

All four hives surviving so far so good. Video here of Phil Chandler giving me some very useful hints and help with my starting with the Top Bar Hive.http://moggo-blog.blogspot.com/2019/01/phil-chandler-gives-me-help-beekeeping.html...